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ArthurFonzarelli
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Affordable Detached (>$400K) w/Vancouver Commute

Wed Mar 07, 2012 10:52 am

Hi - new to posting here but been following the site and others (VCI, Rob Chipman) for years. Question for people here: I have been one of the disgruntled perma-bears who has been waiting on the sidelines since about 2007/08 and very nearly made the plunge - similar to ETB - back in 2008 on a ~$500K "fixer-upper" but decided against it. Prices are probably up 20-30% or more since that trough, and I'm convinced we'll get back down there, but I'm losing patience and some faith.

I'm nearly 40, making six figures (just) and now have two young kids. Wife not working and won't be until kids are at least 4-5 (ie in 4-5 years). I'm still convinced the Vancouver market is unreasonably inflated if someone making double the HOUSEHOLD income can't buy a tear down on Marine Drive. BUT, I'm starting to capitulate. And now with a family I would like to get into something a bit bigger and nicer than my East Van co-op townhouse, which is a steal at $1,300 a month rent.

We are looking at Squamish for detached because you can get a non-teardown for around $400K and I love the community/area. But the one hour commute would be expensive and a bit draining. It seems that Burnaby North and New West are now not possible in this price range, and frankly I'm not sure I'd want to live there anyways. But a nice 45 minute Skytrain commute would be a lot better than a one hour drive.

Any thoughts on the detached market in these areas (N Burnaby; New West; Squamish) in the ~$400K range, commuting, opportunities to low-ball, inventory expectations, etc.?
 
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ArthurFonzarelli
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Re: Affordable Detached (>$400K) w/Vancouver Commute

Mon Apr 09, 2012 10:01 am

Mostly wondering about people's thoughts on whether Squamish will hold value relative to the other more traditional commuter burbs...
Thanks.
 
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DAB
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Re: Affordable Detached (>$400K) w/Vancouver Commute

Tue Apr 10, 2012 11:32 am

Any thoughts on the detached market in these areas (N Burnaby; New West; Squamish) in the ~$400K range, commuting, opportunities to low-ball, inventory expectations, etc.?
Impossible to get a detached for your budget. Best bet is look for LARGE 2 bedroom condos. they have some in the Brentwood area - newer building with ammenities going up to around 1000 square feet. lots of 2 beds are only 700-800 so the size of 1000 is a good size to raise a family
 
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Re: Affordable Detached (>$400K) w/Vancouver Commute

Tue Apr 10, 2012 11:35 am

what's wrong with Clayton Heights?

you discriminating against new yaletown?

p.s.

are you insane you won't find any detached for $400k

what's the prob? you make 6figures and don't want to go with a $600-700k home?

i don't make that much and my home is brand new and $700k
 
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ArthurFonzarelli
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Re: Affordable Detached (>$400K) w/Vancouver Commute

Tue Apr 10, 2012 12:56 pm

I don't want to get into all my personal details but suffice to say that with student loans, travel (ie the stuff you're supposed to be doing in your 20s) my bank balance and portfolio aren't what they could be. And no, a $700K mortage doesn't make sense with a $100K income supporting a family in this city. Not even close. I'm almost paycheque to paycheque and don't live extravagantly...

We have a 1000 sq ft townhouse right now, and I know some people can handle this with two kids and a dog but we can't. We need at LEAST 1,300-1,400 sq ft. We also want to make sure that with only 20% DP that our purchase would be revenue neutral (or almost) if we had to sell in 5 years and rent it out.

I think a SFH in Squamish or Coquitlam or something like that is the only option because with a main living area and rental suite, if we factor in a rate jump on a 5-year from 3.5% to say 6.0% we can still ALMOST cover the mortgage with 2 rental spaces if we had to move and couldn't / won't sell (ie major correction). A $400K condo with a single rental income wouldn't even come close. Plus I see the Van condo market as being a ticking timebomb. The next option if we don't go to Squamish or somewhere toward the Valley for a SFH is probably a big Burnaby or New West townhouse in the $400K range. I don't need new - space and quiet trump newness...

Again curious to see if people think Squamton SFH will hold value. It's an interesting market. I think if SFH VAn inventory continues to rise and values finally drop off 10-15%, Squamish will take a big hit, and fast. I think Squamish price support is probably around 15-20% off where it is now.
 
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Re: Affordable Detached (>$400K) w/Vancouver Commute

Tue Apr 10, 2012 3:51 pm

living in a co-op with a 6 figure salary... is that even allowed?
 
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Re: Affordable Detached (>$400K) w/Vancouver Commute

Tue Apr 10, 2012 5:28 pm

Any thoughts on the detached market in these areas (N Burnaby; New West; Squamish) in the ~$400K range, commuting, opportunities to low-ball, inventory expectations, etc.?
Impossible to get a detached for your budget. Best bet is look for LARGE 2 bedroom condos. they have some in the Brentwood area - newer building with ammenities going up to around 1000 square feet. lots of 2 beds are only 700-800 so the size of 1000 is a good size to raise a family
A little heads up, I've been looking through a handful of condos in the brentwood area, mostly look at 980 sqft - 1300 sqft with 2 or more bedrooms/dens for a family of four with 2 teens. They are much smaller than I thought they would be , especially with the misleading pictures that realtors take at certain angles. I think I'm going to wait for a while before buying any unit since brentwood will undergo a tremendous redevelopment over the next 4 years or so, and that is if I still want to stick around...
 
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Re: Affordable Detached (>$400K) w/Vancouver Commute

Tue Apr 10, 2012 5:30 pm

Hi - new to posting here but been following the site and others (VCI, Rob Chipman) for years. Question for people here: I have been one of the disgruntled perma-bears who has been waiting on the sidelines since about 2007/08 and very nearly made the plunge - similar to ETB - back in 2008 on a ~$500K "fixer-upper" but decided against it. Prices are probably up 20-30% or more since that trough, and I'm convinced we'll get back down there, but I'm losing patience and some faith.

I'm nearly 40, making six figures (just) and now have two young kids. Wife not working and won't be until kids are at least 4-5 (ie in 4-5 years). I'm still convinced the Vancouver market is unreasonably inflated if someone making double the HOUSEHOLD income can't buy a tear down on Marine Drive. BUT, I'm starting to capitulate. And now with a family I would like to get into something a bit bigger and nicer than my East Van co-op townhouse, which is a steal at $1,300 a month rent.

We are looking at Squamish for detached because you can get a non-teardown for around $400K and I love the community/area. But the one hour commute would be expensive and a bit draining. It seems that Burnaby North and New West are now not possible in this price range, and frankly I'm not sure I'd want to live there anyways. But a nice 45 minute Skytrain commute would be a lot better than a one hour drive.

Any thoughts on the detached market in these areas (N Burnaby; New West; Squamish) in the ~$400K range, commuting, opportunities to low-ball, inventory expectations, etc.?
the cure for higher prices is moving to a destination with lower prices
 
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Re: Affordable Detached (>$400K) w/Vancouver Commute

Wed Apr 11, 2012 6:59 am

what's the prob? you make 6figures and don't want to go with a $600-700k home?

i don't make that much and my home is brand new and $700k
Don't listen to instigator. $100K family income is not that much considering the costs to support your families. I think your budget is about right, or can be a bit higher ($500k?) For that money, a large townhouse in Burnaby/coquitlam or an older detached home in Surrey are both good choices IMO.

BTW, I can never understand why people in Van do not mind being the slave of their home. There are so many things in life you can do other than working your butt off for the mortgage payment. Think about RV, boating, and travel. My wife and I work in interior BC. We make $160K in total and built a $350k home here 2 yrs ago. Believe or not, We are some of the poorest people living in my neighborhood. :roll:
 
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jesse1
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Re: Affordable Detached (>$400K) w/Vancouver Commute

Wed Apr 11, 2012 7:12 am

This is from a commenter "Bailing in BC Says" on Vancouvercondo.info:
Arthur, just rent! The easiest way to pay off 100k of your mortgage in one year is to wait a year and buy 100k cheaper.

The scariest thing about the Squamish market is a massive overhang of houses over 600k that are not selling. Check out these graphs and pay close attention to the graph showing year to date sales by price range.
http://www2.topproducerwebsite.com/user ... volume.pdf

There have only been 6 sales this year over 600k and the mls shows 88 properties currently listed. That’s 3.6 years of inventory.

64 of those listings are over 700k. That means there is 8 years of inventory for over 700k.

There’s 44 houses listed over 800k. That’s 11 years of inventory.

There’s 30 houses listed over 900k. Based on the last three months of sales it should take till the end of time for them to sell since not one of them has sold this year.

Many of these houses have been on and off the market for years. I would venture a guess that the majority have been on the market for at least 2 years. Eventually these sellers will have to admit defeat and then what happens? The 900′s become 800′s (or 700′s), the 800′s become 700′s and so on down the line.

Hold on a little bit longer. Now is not the time to capitulate.
There is no shame in overpaying
 
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Re: Affordable Detached (>$400K) w/Vancouver Commute

Wed Apr 11, 2012 8:08 am

I think, Squamish won't hold value if market goes down and it will be extremely difficult to find a buyer when you decide to resale. To find good quality tenants might be also difficult in that area. Read what Lady Luck wrote about Squamish.

I think, having 3 dependents and only $80K down payment you can not afford a decent SFH.
Last edited by curious on Wed Apr 11, 2012 1:55 pm, edited 2 times in total.
 
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Re: Affordable Detached (>$400K) w/Vancouver Commute

Wed Apr 11, 2012 8:41 am

This is from a commenter "Bailing in BC Says" on Vancouvercondo.info:
Arthur, just rent! The easiest way to pay off 100k of your mortgage in one year is to wait a year and buy 100k cheaper.

The scariest thing about the Squamish market is a massive overhang of houses over 600k that are not selling. Check out these graphs and pay close attention to the graph showing year to date sales by price range.
http://www2.topproducerwebsite.com/user ... volume.pdf

There have only been 6 sales this year over 600k and the mls shows 88 properties currently listed. That’s 3.6 years of inventory.

64 of those listings are over 700k. That means there is 8 years of inventory for over 700k.

There’s 44 houses listed over 800k. That’s 11 years of inventory.

There’s 30 houses listed over 900k. Based on the last three months of sales it should take till the end of time for them to sell since not one of them has sold this year.

Many of these houses have been on and off the market for years. I would venture a guess that the majority have been on the market for at least 2 years. Eventually these sellers will have to admit defeat and then what happens? The 900′s become 800′s (or 700′s), the 800′s become 700′s and so on down the line.

Hold on a little bit longer. Now is not the time to capitulate.
Sad part is some people will listen to anonymous posters that to the needs of their families.
 
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Re: Affordable Detached (>$400K) w/Vancouver Commute

Wed Apr 11, 2012 9:51 am

Sad part is some people will listen to anonymous posters that to the needs of their families
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There is no shame in overpaying
 
curious
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Re: Affordable Detached (>$400K) w/Vancouver Commute

Wed Apr 11, 2012 10:10 am

Best bet is look for LARGE 2 bedroom condos. they have some in the Brentwood area - newer building with ammenities going up to around 1000 square feet.
DAB, these days in the Brentwood, if you want a decent new highrise, be ready for around $500/sq.ft. and up.
 
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Re: Affordable Detached (>$400K) w/Vancouver Commute

Wed Apr 11, 2012 10:14 am

what's the prob? you make 6figures and don't want to go with a $600-700k home?

i don't make that much and my home is brand new and $700k
Don't listen to instigator. $100K family income is not that much considering the costs to support your families. I think your budget is about right, or can be a bit higher ($500k?) For that money, a large townhouse in Burnaby/coquitlam or an older detached home in Surrey are both good choices IMO.

BTW, I can never understand why people in Van do not mind being the slave of their home. There are so many things in life you can do other than working your butt off for the mortgage payment. Think about RV, boating, and travel. My wife and I work in interior BC. We make $160K in total and built a $350k home here 2 yrs ago. Believe or not, We are some of the poorest people living in my neighborhood. :roll:
I forgot to mention my house is half paid off and i have a renter so no slavery here.

i sold my old timer home and heck no could i buy the newly constructed home for $700k

i've done some traveling around asia and mexico, BC is home, i've seen the world and it's not all pretty.

thought about buying a boat, i could but wouldn't get to use it enough due to weather.

i already don't ride my 700cc quad enough. People have different priorities or interests.

i'll lay on the beach when i'm retired. Home is where the heart is and where i like to spend most of my time as i also have a home based business for extra dough.

i'll spend my money on cars, snowboarding and booze, my new baby on the way and clothes LOL

anyways i don't have to tell you everything i spend my money on everybody is different.

so the gist of this is no mortgage slavery. I don't recommend getting in over your head to anyone.

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