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VanLord
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The Money Pit Tax

Sat Jun 24, 2017 9:18 am

http://www.theprovince.com/news/local+n ... story.html

Looks as if this tax will cost taxpayers a lot more than expected, and doubtful it will ease the tight rental market
 
jimtan
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Re: The Money Pit Tax

Sat Jun 24, 2017 1:24 pm

"The number of “under-occupied” homes in Vancouver has almost doubled in the past 15 years, from 12,885 to 25,495 dwellings, according to census data.

So although some of those homes will be exempt from the tax, and even if some cheaters skirt the rules, it’s hard to imagine the city not raising enough money to cover the cost of the tax, said Tom Davidoff, a housing economist from UBC’s Sauder School of Business, adding: “I would be very unpleasantly surprised to see the city actually lose money on this deal.”

... This week, Davidoff was far more bullish, saying: “I don’t think $100 million (in first-year revenue) is out of the question...

But even as cost estimates rise, one of the only ways the city could actually lose money, Davidoff noted, would be if a huge number of people decided to rent out their empty homes to avoid the tax.

And if that did happen — in a city where the rental market has become painfully tight — it might be money well spent."

Thumbs Up. Keeps our taxes lower.  :mrgreen:
 
jimtan
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Re: The Money Pit Tax

Fri Jul 28, 2017 7:07 am

Enforcement is gonna be brutal ...

"CRA takes developers to court, seeks information on pre-sale condo flippers

Officials say they want to ensure taxes paid on transactions..."

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-c ... -1.4223488
 
VanLord
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Re: The Money Pit Tax

Fri Jul 28, 2017 8:37 am

Enforcement is gonna be brutal ...

"CRA takes developers to court, seeks information on pre-sale condo flippers

Officials say they want to ensure taxes paid on transactions..."

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-c ... -1.4223488
About 15 years late to the party, but good, As I've said before we never needed a bunch of new taxes, just to enforce the existing taxes.  How many billions in profits walked out of Canada with not a sniff from the CRA.  These transactions should be enforced and a witholding tax applied to a flip
 
VanLord
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Re: The Money Pit Tax

Thu Mar 08, 2018 1:58 pm

"The number of “under-occupied” homes in Vancouver has almost doubled in the past 15 years, from 12,885 to 25,495 dwellings, according to census data.
So it looks like the numbers are coming in quite a bit lower than predicted!
The city won't even give us a straight answer on how many properties actually have to pay the tax.  I'm guessing the Empty Homes Tax will not break even this year.
The city has to lie about the numbers and say 8500 empty or under utilized homes, which includes 2200 people who didn't declare.  As well as all the exemptions, like a property going through re-zoning, or where a person is not using the home due to medical circumstances, etc.
Interesting and again points to the same issues where these governments are building up all the problems and crisis to get the Internet Mob working for them in order to magically solve problems with new taxes, all while pandering for votes.  Its quite brilliant in a way.
 
Harahomes
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Re: The Money Pit Tax

Sun Mar 11, 2018 6:42 am

"The number of “under-occupied” homes in Vancouver has almost doubled in the past 15 years, from 12,885 to 25,495 dwellings, according to census data.
So it looks like the numbers are coming in quite a bit lower than predicted!
The city won't even give us a straight answer on how many properties actually have to pay the tax.  I'm guessing the Empty Homes Tax will not break even this year.
The city has to lie about the numbers and say 8500 empty or under utilized homes, which includes 2200 people who didn't declare.  As well as all the exemptions, like a property going through re-zoning, or where a person is not using the home due to medical circumstances, etc.
Interesting and again points to the same issues where these governments are building up all the problems and crisis to get the Internet Mob working for them in order to magically solve problems with new taxes, all while pandering for votes.  Its quite brilliant in a way.
Empty homes was never really an issue.  What the big issue was is AIR BNB, and of course jealousy.  A lot of these "empty homes" are homes waiting to get demoed and the city is taking a year to complete building permits. 
From my personal experience, I have a client that has been waiting for approvals from the city since mid last year.  We just started abatement this week. 
Also before you all get upset and say we shouldn't be ripping down old homes and putting up new ones in there place, think about this.  The old home is full of mold and asbestos.  Only housed one family.  The new home will house 3 families. 
The only way out of this is increase supply and density.  Not curb demand like the NDP is suggesting.  You can curb demand for a year, maybe 2 years, then all this pent up demand will over run the market and force prices higher.  Not to mention rents will increase in the mean time while people are looking for a place to live.
NDP have got this all wrong
 
reallyreal2
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Re: The Money Pit Tax

Mon Mar 12, 2018 1:08 pm

"The number of “under-occupied” homes in Vancouver has almost doubled in the past 15 years, from 12,885 to 25,495 dwellings, according to census data.
So it looks like the numbers are coming in quite a bit lower than predicted!
The city won't even give us a straight answer on how many properties actually have to pay the tax.  I'm guessing the Empty Homes Tax will not break even this year.
The city has to lie about the numbers and say 8500 empty or under utilized homes, which includes 2200 people who didn't declare.  As well as all the exemptions, like a property going through re-zoning, or where a person is not using the home due to medical circumstances, etc.
Interesting and again points to the same issues where these governments are building up all the problems and crisis to get the Internet Mob working for them in order to magically solve problems with new taxes, all while pandering for votes.  Its quite brilliant in a way.
Empty homes was never really an issue.  What the big issue was is AIR BNB, and of course jealousy.  A lot of these "empty homes" are homes waiting to get demoed and the city is taking a year to complete building permits. 
From my personal experience, I have a client that has been waiting for approvals from the city since mid last year.  We just started abatement this week. 
Also before you all get upset and say we shouldn't be ripping down old homes and putting up new ones in there place, think about this.  The old home is full of mold and asbestos.  Only housed one family.  The new home will house 3 families. 
The only way out of this is increase supply and density.  Not curb demand like the NDP is suggesting.  You can curb demand for a year, maybe 2 years, then all this pent up demand will over run the market and force prices higher.  Not to mention rents will increase in the mean time while people are looking for a place to live.
NDP have got this all wrong
Why is it either/or?  Why not curb demand and increase supply?
And it's not like the NDP is curbing demand - They are curbing a very specific demand so they people that live here have an opportunity.
 
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SethM
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Re: The Money Pit Tax

Mon Mar 12, 2018 2:24 pm

"The number of “under-occupied” homes in Vancouver has almost doubled in the past 15 years, from 12,885 to 25,495 dwellings, according to census data.
So it looks like the numbers are coming in quite a bit lower than predicted!
The city won't even give us a straight answer on how many properties actually have to pay the tax.  I'm guessing the Empty Homes Tax will not break even this year.
The city has to lie about the numbers and say 8500 empty or under utilized homes, which includes 2200 people who didn't declare.  As well as all the exemptions, like a property going through re-zoning, or where a person is not using the home due to medical circumstances, etc.
Interesting and again points to the same issues where these governments are building up all the problems and crisis to get the Internet Mob working for them in order to magically solve problems with new taxes, all while pandering for votes.  Its quite brilliant in a way.
The only way out of this is increase supply and density.  Not curb demand like the NDP is suggesting.  You can curb demand for a year, maybe 2 years, then all this pent up demand will over run the market and force prices higher.  Not to mention rents will increase in the mean time while people are looking for a place to live.
NDP have got this all wrong
Exactly. Leave demand alone. Increase density and get munis to issue building permits much faster. Lack of supply is the problem. But you get all these activists against development but they want a brand new rental apartment for $100 a month. The libtards are responsible for rising prices too.
 
rofina
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Re: The Money Pit Tax

Mon Mar 12, 2018 3:04 pm

Permitting in Metro Van is a disgrace.

There is no way to justify waiting 2 years for a what should be a basic permit for a SFH.

3-4 years to deliver a house is absurd. 
 
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SethM
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Re: The Money Pit Tax

Mon Mar 12, 2018 3:40 pm

Permitting in Metro Van is a disgrace.

There is no way to justify waiting 2 years for a what should be a basic permit for a SFH.

3-4 years to deliver a house is absurd. 
Don't get me started on permitting delays.These government workers think a good paying job is a right. They get every second Friday off and at 4;20 pm stop answering their phones. Lots of sick days and personal days, full benefits and a pension. If you follow up on a permit you are waiting for they get mad. And it's not like you can buy them lunch or dinner or give them a bottle of scotch to get expedited service.

Here is a planner job for $55 an hour.

https://jobs.vancouver.ca/job/Vancouver ... 461534600/

I know they have heavy work loads so hire more and pay overtime, At $77 an hour you would get city workers working evenings and weekends. They pay for themselves with permit fees, CACs, DCCs, etc.

Give developers the option of paying extra fees for a fast track permit. 
 
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thompson2
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Re: The Money Pit Tax

Mon Mar 12, 2018 3:48 pm

Permitting in Metro Van is a disgrace.

There is no way to justify waiting 2 years for a what should be a basic permit for a SFH.

3-4 years to deliver a house is absurd. 
Don't get me started on permitting delays.These government workers think a good paying job is a right. They get every second Friday off and at 4;20 pm stop answering their phones. Lots of sick days and personal days, full benefits and a pension. If you follow up on a permit you are waiting for they get mad. And it's not like you can buy them lunch or dinner or give them a bottle of scotch to get expedited service.

Here is a planner job for $55 an hour.

https://jobs.vancouver.ca/job/Vancouver ... 461534600/

I know they have heavy work loads so hire more and pay overtime, At $77 an hour you would get city workers working evenings and weekends. They pay for themselves with permit fees, CACs, DCCs, etc.

Give developers the option of paying extra fees for a fast track permit. 
:lol:
 
Harahomes
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Re: The Money Pit Tax

Mon Mar 12, 2018 6:32 pm

So it looks like the numbers are coming in quite a bit lower than predicted!
The city won't even give us a straight answer on how many properties actually have to pay the tax.  I'm guessing the Empty Homes Tax will not break even this year.
The city has to lie about the numbers and say 8500 empty or under utilized homes, which includes 2200 people who didn't declare.  As well as all the exemptions, like a property going through re-zoning, or where a person is not using the home due to medical circumstances, etc.
Interesting and again points to the same issues where these governments are building up all the problems and crisis to get the Internet Mob working for them in order to magically solve problems with new taxes, all while pandering for votes.  Its quite brilliant in a way.
Empty homes was never really an issue.  What the big issue was is AIR BNB, and of course jealousy.  A lot of these "empty homes" are homes waiting to get demoed and the city is taking a year to complete building permits. 
From my personal experience, I have a client that has been waiting for approvals from the city since mid last year.  We just started abatement this week. 
Also before you all get upset and say we shouldn't be ripping down old homes and putting up new ones in there place, think about this.  The old home is full of mold and asbestos.  Only housed one family.  The new home will house 3 families. 
The only way out of this is increase supply and density.  Not curb demand like the NDP is suggesting.  You can curb demand for a year, maybe 2 years, then all this pent up demand will over run the market and force prices higher.  Not to mention rents will increase in the mean time while people are looking for a place to live.
NDP have got this all wrong
Why is it either/or?  Why not curb demand and increase supply?
And it's not like the NDP is curbing demand - They are curbing a very specific demand so they people that live here have an opportunity.
By "curbing" demand your not fixing the problem.  "Curbing" demand just means trying to get people not to buy a house.  What are they supposed to do? live on the street?  "Curbing" demand is just delaying the inevitiable. "Curbing" demand is like sticking your finger in a facet hopeing it will stop a leak.
 
reallyreal2
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Re: The Money Pit Tax

Mon Mar 12, 2018 7:02 pm

Empty homes was never really an issue.  What the big issue was is AIR BNB, and of course jealousy.  A lot of these "empty homes" are homes waiting to get demoed and the city is taking a year to complete building permits. 
From my personal experience, I have a client that has been waiting for approvals from the city since mid last year.  We just started abatement this week. 
Also before you all get upset and say we shouldn't be ripping down old homes and putting up new ones in there place, think about this.  The old home is full of mold and asbestos.  Only housed one family.  The new home will house 3 families. 
The only way out of this is increase supply and density.  Not curb demand like the NDP is suggesting.  You can curb demand for a year, maybe 2 years, then all this pent up demand will over run the market and force prices higher.  Not to mention rents will increase in the mean time while people are looking for a place to live.
NDP have got this all wrong
Why is it either/or?  Why not curb demand and increase supply?
And it's not like the NDP is curbing demand - They are curbing a very specific demand so they people that live here have an opportunity.
By "curbing" demand your not fixing the problem.  "Curbing" demand just means trying to get people not to buy a house.  What are they supposed to do? live on the street?  "Curbing" demand is just delaying the inevitiable. "Curbing" demand is like sticking your finger in a facet hopeing it will stop a leak.
Well we are talking about stopping people from buying:
a) properties in Vancouver and leaving them empty
b) buying vacation homes while not paying tax in the province
c) leaving homes empty
d) while not being Canadian while just using the housing market as a store of your proceeds of crime
Each one of these things curbs demand - or if you want to look at it another way, frees up an additional unit for the locals to buy which increases supply.
In all 3 scenarios above, you are not displacing someone from their home because they don't live here in the first place.
 
reallyreal2
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Re: The Money Pit Tax

Mon Mar 12, 2018 7:12 pm

Permitting in Metro Van is a disgrace.

There is no way to justify waiting 2 years for a what should be a basic permit for a SFH.

3-4 years to deliver a house is absurd. 
Don't get me started on permitting delays.These government workers think a good paying job is a right. They get every second Friday off and at 4;20 pm stop answering their phones. Lots of sick days and personal days, full benefits and a pension. If you follow up on a permit you are waiting for they get mad. And it's not like you can buy them lunch or dinner or give them a bottle of scotch to get expedited service.

Here is a planner job for $55 an hour.

https://jobs.vancouver.ca/job/Vancouver ... 461534600/

I know they have heavy work loads so hire more and pay overtime, At $77 an hour you would get city workers working evenings and weekends. They pay for themselves with permit fees, CACs, DCCs, etc.

Give developers the option of paying extra fees for a fast track permit. 
So your solution is bribes?  Awesome.
$55 an hour... LOL...they can afford a 1 bedroom for their family at that wage.  
 
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SethM
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Re: The Money Pit Tax

Mon Mar 12, 2018 8:31 pm

Permitting in Metro Van is a disgrace.

There is no way to justify waiting 2 years for a what should be a basic permit for a SFH.

3-4 years to deliver a house is absurd. 
Don't get me started on permitting delays.These government workers think a good paying job is a right. They get every second Friday off and at 4;20 pm stop answering their phones. Lots of sick days and personal days, full benefits and a pension. If you follow up on a permit you are waiting for they get mad. And it's not like you can buy them lunch or dinner or give them a bottle of scotch to get expedited service.

Here is a planner job for $55 an hour.

https://jobs.vancouver.ca/job/Vancouver ... 461534600/

I know they have heavy work loads so hire more and pay overtime, At $77 an hour you would get city workers working evenings and weekends. They pay for themselves with permit fees, CACs, DCCs, etc.

Give developers the option of paying extra fees for a fast track permit. 
So your solution is bribes?  Awesome.
$55 an hour... LOL...they can afford a 1 bedroom for their family at that wage.  
What's wrong with Coquitlam, Surrey, Langley, Cloverdale, Abbotsford, etc. Lot's of affordable townhouses and houses there.

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